BCMB 042 - The Pastor as Missionary.mp3: Audio automatically transcribed by Sonix

BCMB 042 - The Pastor as Missionary.mp3: this mp3 audio file was automatically transcribed by Sonix with the best speech-to-text algorithms. This transcript may contain errors.

Zach Hillman:
The folks that we work with. And that's been challenging that the amount of trauma and back story that's just horrendous has been alarming. So helping work with the not just not just indigenous, just community in general that we have just working with them and see them overcome and see them being able to find hope and find that perseverance and endurance and resiliency that only the Holy Spirit can give someone as we are enduring the trials that come in life. That has been great.

Intro:
Welcome to the BCMB podcast, Pastor to Pastor. This is a podcast by the British Columbia Conference of Mennonite Brethren Churches. We want to help equip and encourage pastors, churches and anyone else who wants to listen in and be more effective in their ministry. This is episode 42 Ministry in an Urban Context with Zach Hillman.

Rob Thiessen:
Hey everyone, this is Rob Thiessen. I am the conference pastor for the B.C. Mennonite Brethren Churches and delighted to have you along for a conversation today with Zach Hillman and Zach and Cheryl and their family live in Port Alberni. Zach is one of our pastors with the BC Mennonite Brethren Churches and it's our hope today. We were just praying about that. Our conversation would be an encouragement to all of you who are listening as your eyes are open to what what serving the Lord looks like in a totally different context. And Zach, why don't you, as our guest today, just introduce yourself to our listeners and tell them a little bit about the community that shape you as a person that shaped your faith. So, yeah, welcome aboard today.

Zach Hillman:
Great. Well, I'm honored and humbled to be even asked. So it's good to be here. Yeah. So I'm an import. I'm from Texas originally. Grew up on an old pecan orchard down in Texas and Houston, Texas, and grew up and it was Texas so it's Baptist where I grew up in a big Baptist church down in Texas. Parents are both solid believers, and it's one of those you hear a lot about megachurches. Now, that was all I knew. It was 10,000 some people, a big church, that was just what church was to me. And as I grew up in that kind of environment throughout all my childhood university years, like a lot of a lot of folks had a lot of questions of what about this? Is this really real? How can we know? And I never wandered from faith, but just questioned a lot and never felt that settled. But there was and I was I was on track to be a musician. So the concept of being a pastor was totally foreign to me because I literally never met my senior pastor growing up because it's a megachurch. So I never met him. And here's the guy on stage far away or on the that was who it was. So it just constant of that was just not even on my radar. I was going to be.

Rob Thiessen:
This didn't happen to be Joel Osteen's church, did.

Zach Hillman:
It? No, no, no. Okay. Okay. Someone asked you that last.

Rob Thiessen:
Said you said it was a Baptist church. That's right. That's Joel Osteen is not Baptist. Okay.

Zach Hillman:
No. Yea Same city. There's quite a few of big churches down there. I remember driving to church and I would see his dad on the billboards, you know, coming to Lakewood Church. But anyway, so I was planning on being a musician, playing in symphony orchestras, and such was what my dream was always. And there's one night I was in an opera pit. I was playing down the orchestra under the stage, and I played trumpet. And when you play trumpet, an opera is there is not a lot to do. So you read a lot. And the guy next to me was reading the book Taste for Christ and that famous Lee Strobel book. And I just asked, What are you reading? And he goes, You know what? The Lord is telling me? You should have it. And he gave you the book right there. And what? So I went home and read that book and that really I bring it up because that was a really influential moment in my life, because the first time I saw that there were good answers out there, the answers were available to these different questions that I was having. And that really changed the direction of my my life and that orchestra pit there. And I ended up coming to Vancouver to work a study with the symphony up in Vancouver. I went to First Baptist downtown Vancouver, and there is where I was started really feeling calls and ministry and exploring. I really grew on my faith a lot and just learning how to just learn theology and how to explain to faith and how to reach out to people. And again, the world was the music world. So that was the token Christian and the groups that I was in. So a lot of great conversations just about faith and belief and all this kind of stuff that really drew me and my desire to learn how to explain faith and teach faith.

Rob Thiessen:
Were you there were you there when Bruce Milne was the pastor?

Zach Hillman:
You know what I showed up like? I think it was like less than a month after he had resigned. Okay, okay. So I was there only I was only there two years I was in Vancouver, but it was that two year interim where they had no senior pastor. But it's kind of cool because they just brought in guys from Regent and Kerry. So I was getting to hear friends and Daryl Johnson, all these like big names come into debris after weeks. That was I had no idea that big names at the time. But now I know those are solid theologian pastor figures in the community. So it was a really cool experience to be there and in there. So yeah, that was so really that's where I like. It's First Baptist where it really started going, I'm getting tired of just playing music for rich people. I want just in the more significant with my life. And I went off to well, also there, I met my wife Cheryl. She was at First Baptist as well to is working with the youth and I was doing music stuff and we got married, ended up going to Alberta and spent the next 12 years in Alberta, went to seminary and pastored out there for dozen years or so, and now I'm out here.

Rob Thiessen:
What church were you in there?

Zach Hillman:
And it was still the Baptist community. So I was at I was at West View Baptist was which that I was part time there when I was at seminary. And then I went to Richmond Hill Baptist Church full time when I graduated from seminary, both from in Calgary.

Rob Thiessen:
Good. And then and then you ended up in Port Alberni is where you are today.

Zach Hillman:
Yeah, because all along my whole my path was a musician. So even still I was I went from a part time music minister to music and discipleship and then now to senior pastor when I'm here is kind of how it kind of evolved my path.

Rob Thiessen:
Yeah. Oh, that's fantastic. Thanks for sharing that Zach. You know, a big part of my own life and growth as a pastor. It has always been hearing other pastors stories. And even now I still do that for perspective and encouragement. Read people's stories I'm reading at home. The story of the woman who wrote Uncle Tom's Cabin and her father was Lyman Beecher, a pastor. So I'm just curious as to what he was a Congregationalist pastor in England. And yeah, it's fascinating. So I love to hear stories that's always helped shape me. So part of the podcast is to hear your story and your journey and already, you know, it's just amazing testimony to us of God's faithfulness and that it was, you know, an orchestra pit where somebody was reading Lee Struggles book that caught your attention and that the Holy Spirit used to begin to redirect your your life as a young adult. So now you're in Port Alberni. So tell us a little bit about the experience in Port Alberni. Give us an overview of what's unique about Gateway Church in Port Alberni and yeah, what what the place is like, what have what what's been your experience there?

Zach Hillman:
All right. Yeah, good question. So I've been here eight years now and it's been radically different than anywhere else I've been. I mean, Houston, Texas, large church to Vancouver, large church and then and community and then Calgary and then now I end up in Port Alberni, which is a small rural town. It's kind of it's a mill town, logging town, fishing town kind of feel to it. And it's rural, but it has all the problems of an inner city is kind of where we're at. I mean, we've got had someone doing drugs behind my church just last week. You know, we have lots of those struggles of constantly getting graffitied and break ins and drugs and, you know, put up awnings. When I was moving here, I remember I was looking at the town, so I didn't know much about it. And it was at that time it was infamously ranked the worst place to live in Canada based on different metrics of health and longevity and income. And it's still we're still I think we're tied for the highest child poverty rate right now.

Zach Hillman:
So it's a lot of struggles in our communities. Beautiful place. I mean, when I moved here, I hear people complain, like, what's so beautiful here, though? It's a beautiful community, just man lakes and rivers and ocean and mountains. It's amazing to be here. But the city has, you know, had some struggles to it. See, we also I mean, uniqueness is there's a large indigenous first nation population in our community. Like the stop sign by my house is in a new town with the local to shot language. So it's a large indigenous population here and around my church building as well. And so a lot of our ministry and work has been with First Nations, First Nations here and some cool things there. Just we have a lady in our church who's in town. So she came here to be a missionary among the First Nation community. And so we are blessed to have her as part of our church. And she has done so much legwork and groundwork to build trust and to meet people. So that's been.

Rob Thiessen:
How long has she been there?

Zach Hillman:
She preceded me by, I think three or four years, so dozen years or so. I guess she's been here.

Rob Thiessen:
At the church or in the community?

Zach Hillman:
Both we're the first church she landed at and she came. I think they came. And so, yeah, so as far as unique, that's rural but inner city fill and the large indigenous population is something I've never experienced before in the largest city like Houston or Vancouver or Calgary. Didn't work much with Indigenous, so that's been a big learning curve for me and they're also being we're a small church. We do a lot of ministry. That's something I almost mentioned every Sunday when I talk about what's coming up this week. And when I say small, when I came here, we had 17 members. So it's small. It's not like 100% small. It's like small. So it's a small church, but we do a lot of a lot of outreach and different ministries. It's been a lot of trial and error. Just seeing what hits home, what can we sustain? What's the community responding to? Right now, we're doing some cool stuff. We started doing an art club after school for the kids, and that's been really well received. So we have we have basically we have a guy who goes to our church and he's at the high school. He's a wants to be an artist. And he and Cheryl, my wife, they help teach arts and crafts and such and they do Bible stories there. We start a tutoring program after school to help kids in our community, to learn, to just to read and basic math skills and all that kind of stuff.

Zach Hillman:
I could go on and on. We've got youth group, of course, and ladies Bible studies and Bible studies, all that kind of stuff we do. A neat thing we started doing because I live in a farm. A little back story. We have some goats here and a dairy farm and chickens and ducks and all that. We got involved with a program where we got to pick up food from the grocery store that they don't want and we can take it back to our place. And because I'm a pastor, I'm allowed to distribute that to our community. And so that's been a neat, unexpected ministry we've got to do where we go on Sundays after church, my family go and pick up food and I'm talking it's about banana boxes. We'll get a dozen or so banana boxes of food. Some of it's not fit for humans. We just give it to our goats. But whatever stuff that's good, we're able to hand and distribute and give out. We had, I think, four or five families come over on Sunday this week just to pick up food and to give out food. So that's our own little food hamper ministry, I guess we get to have, which is.

Rob Thiessen:
You do that from from your place.

Zach Hillman:
Yep.

Rob Thiessen:
Okay. And how did the word get out? Like, is it just the advertise is just word of mouth or you got some sign up free food or what's how do you how do you get.

Zach Hillman:
No, I don't. Because at my house I don't open up to the community because I don't like I don't just advertise for everyone. But I we have it at church as well and pre-COVID we used to have food all the time in our sanctuary we had a kind of food pantry we'd have. We don't have that right now. We have we keep some food there, but it's largely word of mouth and just people we know because we have a large pretty good network of people we know and families, we know. And so because we can't sustain, nor do we need us to sustain the same level that like Salvation Army, is only like four blocks away from us. And so we don't need to try and compete with them because they're doing a wonderful work in our community and lots of that. So we're not trying to double up with them or so it's our own as we're reaching people that may fall through the cracks in our own, a pretty good network that we know people in our community. And so it's just soliciting, asking around.

Rob Thiessen:
Last week I was just visiting the New Hope Church in North delta and they out front, they have a like a small pantry, like just a six by six outdoor closet, basically with with two doors and they stock that. I was talking to the lady who stalks it. She says sometimes a couple of times a day and and the community of Surrey actually gets behind them and gives them a statement of cash to buy food and yeah, she said, it's just one of the ways that people in the community know that the that they're sharing the love of Christ by meeting needs of people. So that's a unique ministry. You're involved a lot of things. I love to talk with you about a whole whack of those things that you're doing, but maybe just, you know, I want to make, let's talk about the First Nations and how, like you said, this was one of the surprises for you coming there, right. You with your big city experience. And I think a lot of people, a lot of pastors are like basically look at the First Nations question and say, well, practically this feels invisible. Like we just don't see the people. And I'm pretty sure myself personally and for many of us as some of that is just we've like we just screen it out, we become effectively blind to it, even if it is close by to us. There are people that disappear to us and and that's on us. But, that's not the situation in Port Alberni. All sudden your eyes are open. You're like, Oh, you know everything around here, this is the culture. So like, tell us a little bit about that journey and what does how has that affected you? So over the years and how many years have you been there now?

Zach Hillman:
This is my seventh year. Yeah.

Rob Thiessen:
Yeah, yeah. So tell us a little bit about your journey with that.

Zach Hillman:
Yeah. So. It all started pretty much my first year here. I was at a coffee shop in town just doing some sermon writing, and it was one of those big tables, you know, like a big table. And so I was sitting there and two guys came and sat next to me and they started speaking Nuu-chah-nulth, the local language. And one of the guys was a white guy that was like, so I looked and said, How are you? What are you speaking? I had no idea what they were speaking, what language. So what are you guys speaking? And it turns out they were language teachers in the town. So the white guy had a PhD in linguistics and he was helping teaching and revitalizing the language and so and they invited me to come out to language circles to start learning. And so I did that. So I jumped right in because I actually enjoy language. I was a weird guy in seminary who loved Greek and Hebrew class because I thought it was fun to learn. So I jumped in right away and that has opened up a massive door where every week I was meeting with elders and just the indigenous community every week learning language and and building friendships and a few of the folks, I became pretty pretty good friends with that they would some of those sweet ladies are bringing bannock and jam and I would bring some duck eggs and we'd kind of trade and just it was a great experience. And so I met a lot of people that way. And there's a large Haahuupayak, a First Nations school, just 2 minutes from my house as well.

Zach Hillman:
And so we have some people, our church that are that teach at the school. And so and we have Ann the lady at our church who does a lot of work with First Nations. So it's just really through those three things that we have a pretty large network. We have a bit of foundation and trust known and so we just started started trying to think of what, you know, how do you say this? It's just being its living life with the people and meeting and helping meeting needs and being with and being with them. So it's, you know, we learn right off the bat, there's everyone knows this now. There's a pretty the church has not represented itself well in the past and so there's a pretty big distrust and disconnect. And so a large part of our task is just to heal that image of the church that we are. We are in your corner. We are for you. You know, we we want the best and making friends. And so that's been a large part of that journey, was just making friends. And I got a cool experience there was a lady that, she was one to translate a children's Bible into a dialect, in Nuu-chah-nulth. And so the PhD guy was hoping to do that, and I got to be the theological expert on some of the terms. That was a really cool thing I never thought I would do in my life, I was like, well, it's kind of cool. Good to be a part of that.

Rob Thiessen:
Yeah. You're a site agent for Wycliffe Translators.

Zach Hillman:
Yeah.

Rob Thiessen:
That's cool. Have you, have you worked on any, any particular verses,of scripture or parts of Scripture and thought about articulating them into the indigenous language?

Zach Hillman:
Yeah, there is. I couldn't do it right now. Psalm 24:1, "The earth is a Lord's and everything in it. You know that verse? I learned to do in Nuu-chah-nulth because that's actually very strong in Nuu-chah-nulth concept as well is the Earth is the Lord's. So that's one I had memorized. But right now I couldn't tell you what it is.

Rob Thiessen:
What are some of the things? What are some of the you've identified totally an obvious thing just about friendship and I don't know if you ever listened to the podcast that I did with John Johnson and Tim McCarthy, but John's big thing when I asked him, so what what take away could people have for thinking about how to just be, be missional, be neighborly? And yeah, basically his thing was think about right relationships with people like friendships based on you know because just history of exploitation and hurt and a lot of harm and things get patched when you start just being a decent friend to people, which is, it seems to me, what you've been doing. So what sort of, like bridges, maybe things that you've learned that you feel like you've received from getting to know indigenous friends over the last these last seven or eight years? What are things that you feel like you've been enriched in? Like you mentioned, this concept of the Earth is the Lord's, and that's something that resonates. What are other ways that that's shaped your ministry, your thinking pastorally, or are you thinking theologically about God, about the gospel?

Zach Hillman:
Community is so essential and vital. I got to be a witness of a blanket ceremony different kind of blanket ceremony. I was on the on the reserve and I was talking to people and I got invited to go to this ceremony. But what it was, there was an elderly man and the ceremony was they wrapped him in a blanket and the community surrounds him saying, we're going to take care of you. We're going to pour into you and be your encouragement. And that aspect of community is so vital, which is why I was talking to someone about that the next day. And they were saying, do you see why when the white folks came and they gave them blankets full of smallpox, how treacherous that was? Do you see how you know, and so that such a breach of community is what's been the biggest thing? And so it's rebuilding that community and us too, as you know, in the suburbs and such. That's something that we could really learn from this, that community aspect of being community together and as church.

Zach Hillman:
It's so much church hopping going on. Sometimes I've used that. I'm done this, I'm going somewhere else. It's like, let's relearn community. And so much of our ministry stuff is really it's building community. We just had a potluck last week. We had potluck and game night. We had about 35 First Nations, I'm guessing, roughly around there that came out and joined us and it was just bringing food together, playing games together, building community and our art club and art shows we do. It's just again building community around crafts. And so it's that's a big thing that I've learned is the importance of community. And it's kind of humbling as a preacher and realizing that people aren't really coming to hear me. They're coming for community. That's why people are coming. You know, hopefully I'm preaching the word and that's powerful and of course, is living and all that. But that's when people come, it's usually not, it's to develop that community.

Rob Thiessen:
Right. Well, that's ok so you touched on community. That's a concept we talk a lot about. People say community. And I think hopefully, you know, you don't have to explain that too much, but let's just pretend we're kind of ignorant about what the word actually means. So when you talk about community, what are the essential aspects of that? You just said one thing that it's not. You said community is not them showing up to hear me give a lecture like that's not community or at least not the community they're looking for. And then, of course, you hinted on the food. So talk a little bit more. What are you what are some of the attributes of community that, you know, that you've learned and that even if they're obvious, just tell us what does community mean?

Zach Hillman:
Iisaak is a huge principle in Nuu-chah-nulth that means respect. And so it's learning to respect one another and respect yourself. And so and that also includes holding one another up as far as respecting too much, allow you to throw your life away like this. So it's that respect of one another is a big part of community. Support in that, you're a fisherman, I'm a logger. I'll help you with firewood. Can you help me with fish? I have a friend of mine. He's a boat builder and he got and some clients pay him in fish. You know, it's kind of. You know.

Rob Thiessen:
Right. So you mentioned this before. It's the trading, it's the sharing of resources and. Yeah, okay, that's cool. That's that's that's a lot more personable than just, you know, handing over cash the way we do things. You know, when you're actually, hey, this is what I produced with my hands. This is what you produced and you build a bond there, right?

Zach Hillman:
Yeah, because that's it's much more interpersonal. It's more One of things I learned in Nuu-chah-nulth was there's no word for cousin. It's everyone's it's brother, you know, and we see it it's much more related that we are all a large family. I'm not going to ask for that. I'll give you some brownies if you gave me this, it's that kind of concept and that all comes out of trust. And that relates it together and just and it's just time. My goodness. It takes time to build that. That's been for me as a pastor, sometimes been a bit of a challenge. You want to see the we want to see some of the church grow and more you know solid core, all those kind of things, but it just takes time and, and so I guess that's.

Rob Thiessen:
That's good. No, that's super helpful. What about when you're some of the roadblocks, right. So when I think about how people sometimes react to what they what they don't understand and I probably shared this before on the other podcast, but I remember for me back when Richard Twist was speaking, when our family was at YWAM like 20 years ago, Richard was an indigenous guy from from the US and was lecturing and, he said, Oh, you Christians, you just get all upset when you see a dreamcatcher hanging there. You think it's some old cult symbol, But then he told us to pull out our wallets and he said, you know, take out your $1 bill there and what do you see on the back there? And of course, it's a pyramid with an all seeing eye, which is a masonic symbol. And he goes, You guys carry that around in your wallet all day long and it doesn't bother you in the least, but you set your hair on fire because you think some dreamcatcher is, you know, a symbol or a demonic symbol. I think he didn't really delve deep into it, but I remember thinking, yeah, you know, we're easily freaked out about things that we're not accustomed to, and then we make assumptions about it. So how has that been for you? Like, have you found yourself in situations like wondering what is the spiritual message here and how do you deal with it? Like, because spirituality and community is obviously closely linked in the indigenous community, right? Ceremonies and belief systems. So how like tell us a little bit how you have approached those and how you process that and how you've been thinking about that?

Zach Hillman:
You know, there's a lady that comes. She's indigenous. And she is in my in my home group every week. And we love her, wonderful Christian lady. She teaches at the First Nation school as well. And so I'm not blessed by it. I just see it because it's, she has a bringing up because she has a, what do you call, like a medicine wheel on the front of her Bible. And it's got like, you know it's I read Richard Twist's book, "Rescuing the Gospel from the Cowboys". You know, he talked about one of the things that really caught me was like we're so worried about the mixing up syncretism. You syncretism is actually a lot, he said he said the word syncretism came from when the creeds came together to do something greater together, Something greater, maybe it's not. Maybe syncretism isn't always bad. Maybe it's just reclaiming these things for the gospel. And I don't know. Don't lynch me for being a heretic here. I'm just, you know, I'm saying I don't. I take it because so much. We had a big you know, there was a lawsuit here a few years ago in our community over some ceremonies done in the school. And one of the way the first nations community responded was we don't see it as religion and we don't separate that. Our culture is our spirituality. It's all one thing. And so it's so I'm not plussed about it. I just we talked about.

Rob Thiessen:
You're not what about it? You're not.

Zach Hillman:
I don't get upset about that. Oh upset about it okay. I see it really as part of the part of culture. Yeah. Yeah. And we talked to this a few times as well as talk to them about what does this mean to you? What is it you actually believe? Like spirits are coming through that then we should have a talk about that. Yeah, but it goes it's kind of like when people were across is a lot of people are crosses that don't even have nothing to do with Jesus. Right. It was a cultural thing and so a lot of it and so easy to see it. Well, I'll ask you about it. So what does that tell me about it? And I get right there. Okay. I know it's just a culture thing for them or they or sometimes they'll believe that it is a spiritual thing. There's power there. Okay, then we'll talk about later or whatever. Right. If I get the right to do so.

Rob Thiessen:
So curiosity is a really good answer. I like that Zach and it's hard to remember in the situation because maybe we have an initial reaction. I think more and more pastors, we have to think like missionaries. Like if missionaries go into a new culture and the first thing they do is say, this is wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong, you know, how effective is that going to be? Like, you have to understand first, right? You have to ask, help me understand and look for Bridges. I got an email a while ago from somebody who was upset that one of our churches was having an outdoor service. I think it must have been tied to Reconciliation week or day, and they were having outdoor service where they were going to invite people to listen to Jesus, speak to them through the land, you know, and really thinking about it as that they might learn something and look for a bridge. Right. And so you're spotting opportunities to say, oh, here's a place I can learn something from someone and maybe build a bridge of community and friendship.

Zach Hillman:
Out of curiosity, curiosity is a good way to phrase it. It's about being. Realizing we are missionaries. We are on their land. And it's their culture and. Yeah.

Rob Thiessen:
Yeah. Talked to you a little bit about. I was curious about the arts club. And also, like you said, you had a desire in your heart early to be a musician, an orchestra musician, no less. Playing. Did you play trombone?

Zach Hillman:
Trumpet.

Rob Thiessen:
Trumpet. Okay, So if you were already into orchestra work and stuff, you're pretty deep into it, like, you know. And now God called you into pastoral work. Has there any been any connection? Does the music and that side of it come into your life and ministry in the community? I'm just just curious about that.

Zach Hillman:
Yea, actually, it's a big part of what I do here. Not a big part, but I volunteer with the school. I offer free lessons at the high school for music. I did that yesterday, actually, for a couple hours, just doing some lessons. I'm playing the last post at the school's Remembrance Day ceremony next week, and I'm in a jazz community jazz band. We just finally it's been two years off, but finally get started up again and so we start up again this fall and a jazz band here. So yeah, I play quite a bit in the community. I would say it's really hasn't bore a lot of fruit yet for ministry, but it's fun. So yeah, I couldn't imagine life without music in it.

Rob Thiessen:
Okay, so and you guys got you have a full life with your family. We were talking a little bit before the podcast. You got four children and they're entering the teen years, so that's busy for you and Cheryl. Cheryl's doing what in the community?

Zach Hillman:
She's been a teacher here for a few years and yeah, so she teaches at a local elementary school. She's on staff here and been doing that for a while. And yes, so we have four kids in the school system. So it's her teaching with four kids. The Hillman clan is pretty well known in the districts.

Rob Thiessen:
So in all that community involvement that you're describing, like talk to us a little bit about the disciple making call on your life. Like, you know, you mentioned that the church is small and you've got lots of activity. Where do you see opportunities for making disciples for your teaching ministry and what does that look like? Where do you think your best contribution most where do you see some fruit from leading people to know Christ to grow in him? What are the opportunities there that are are happening?

Zach Hillman:
Good question. I haven't had to change a lot of my approach moving from Alberta to out here, because one of the peculiar things is that I would say easily more non-Christians and Christians have called Gateway their church as far as our community. And so that's been that's. Have I changed my approach to preaching and teaching? And so our discipleship, we try and do cooperate everything. So like we talked about the art club and tutoring both of those outreach as we do, there's optional Bible study time for the kids to be a part of our youth group. We do devotions on Friday nights. I started doing a after school Bible study on Tuesdays for, as a way of teaching more, of helping kids to grow more in their faith and learn more just the scriptures and theology and who are God is. And to go deeper. And so it's trying to find ways to have that kind of we have the outreach component where you're building those bridges, making relationships, and from there trying to draw people. If you want to go deeper, you're welcome to come here. You know, I have a coffee shop, I go to a coffee shop in town that's open for anyone.

Zach Hillman:
And I'm there at 1:00 on Thursdays, where I drop in and we talk about whatever is on your mind and ask about or talk about we talk about that there. So it's so basically trying to have that funnel where it's kind of build bridges, relationships and invite those to the next level of, hey, if you want to study more and talk more about this, more questions, let's talk about that. And a lot of what I've been doing discipling is really more one on one and that I was so used to the big churches. It's so my experience there, it was all programmatic driven. It's we'll have a class on this, we'll have a course on this. But just because of our nature or size, you do a class on this, they got two people there. It's kind of awkward. So it's much more one on one. Just this meet and we're going to talk through this together. And so it's a lot more of that aspect. I love to have classes of forty people coming. I just don't have that.

Rob Thiessen:
Yeah. So what sort of what sort of evidence have you seen of God's spirit working, God's word growing people. What do you see that is encouraging to you in terms of them growing as disciples? Have people made decisions to say, I want to follow Christ or decided to be baptized or any. Or How's that? How's that experience?

Zach Hillman:
Yeah, we just had a kid just two weeks ago accept Christ, which is amazing with I don't want to broadcast the story, but the folks that we work with and that's been challenging that the amount of trauma and back story is just horrendous, has been alarming. And so helping work with, not just indigenous, just community in general that we have, but just working with them and see them. Overcome and see them being able to find hope and find that perseverance and endurance and resiliency that only the Holy Spirit can give someone as we are enduring the trials that come in life. That has been great to see people turn. Not turn to what so many of the world turned to, the drugs and the alcohol and that kind of stuff. To find a remedy, to turn to the gospel and turn to the Lord and find solace and refuge like David did in the Lord. That's where it's been, really, awesome to see happen and to see people whose lives have been pretty tough, I can't imagine that. And to see them find hope in Christ. And it's that true gospel you hear about, it's like, man, that's like this is it. Or as I, despite all you've been through, like, you got to know God is good and He loves you. And yeah, there's still hope and there's. Can't imagine that hope that we can have. And so that's a lot where we are at working with just with that aspect of the gospel of. With that in, there as I was saying and I passed over but I just got a kid just two weeks ago who one of our youths who said he wants to follow Christ. And so that's amazing. So now, we figure out how can we disciple this youth and help him to grow and know the Lord. So yeah.

Rob Thiessen:
Oh wow that's encouraging and praise the Lord for that evidence of the spirit of God working. So in all that you're describing. I'm guessing that must present some challenges, though, even with finances or church sustainability, because so much of your work is like mission work in the community. Right? Gateway's there and the church is important as a community, but this isn't a community where you've got a bunch of tithing, dedicated, servant minded people who are there, or do you have those kind of people? I don't know just how do you survive and pay the bills as a church? How's that been going? How have I seen the Lord provide? You're still there and I know you've got a few tricks up your sleeve with your family farm and everything, but just tell us different ways that you've seen God meet your needs. And maybe this is for prayer for us as a community. How, you could use help. Tell us about that to.

Zach Hillman:
By the grace of God. You know, when I came here, I said, we have enough for six months to keep it afloat and I'm in the eighth year and we're still in that same boat. You know, it's like, man, but the Lord has sustained us through it all and in many different ways. And one of our constant prayer requests is just for co laborers for some. So much of our work is outreach and missional work. It would be lovely to have some more families to walk with and to collaborate with. That's been a constant prayer of ours, just to send out favors for the harvest. But the Lord has provided and honestly, our family has just been incredible in helping with that and keeping the building afloat because we've had kind of everything thrown at us with the major flood during COVID. And we had we lost, just kind of wiped out a lot of our stuff. And then right when it finished and rebuilding that, some folks broke in and just tore the place apart and cleaned us out. So it's just it's been hit after hit and but the Lord has sustained us and we are very frugal like we we are on everything we do is basically out of pocket, like we're buying the art supplies for the kids. We're picking up the food, we are buying the snacks for youth and Bible study or we're baking the stuff, you know, not all me, but people in church that's there. We don't have we don't. There's not budget for anything. But so we have to change our approach to how we do stuff to it's much more homegrown grassroots kind of feel to it of how we how we do things. And but the Lord does. I can't speak highly enough of our MB community and how different churches at different places in times have said, hey, we want to bless you guys and help you guys and support. And that's really been the difference that's enabled me not to have to find more work to do to make things to make things work.

Rob Thiessen:
It's interesting that that dependency on, like you said, trading and it really has been a part of what's allowed you to be in the ministry with the community in a unique way. Right. Because you're involving volunteers. Everybody's leaning in and they're doing things on a let's help one another basis. But I just we can all empathize that has been pretty tough on you and Cheryl and the family. A big adjustment there. You've also been through some personal stuff, right? You both you and Sheryl, have had some pretty significant health challenges over the last little while. Just tell us about that and where you're at and how you're doing, how we can pray for you and maybe even just if there's something that the Lord has been teaching you through that share that with us to.

Zach Hillman:
Yeah. So. Yea so my wife was diagnosed with muscular dystrophy, a couple of years ago. And so that was tough. But it's not like. At the slow, steady thing. And so hopefully, by the grace of God, she will have strength for many, many years. You just never you never know. So that's been a lot of doctor appointments with that and a lot of just sobering conversations. But yes, that's been tough. But she is doing well right now. She's doing fine. And so basically our goal with her is just to stay as strong and healthy as you can for as long as you can and the Lord sustain her. And I had my own journey about, it was over a year ago. I was diagnosed with Lyme disease and fortunately I was able to catch it early on.

Rob Thiessen:
It's something people get it and don't know they have it typically.

Zach Hillman:
Yeah, yeah. So mine, I was just feeling, off, I felt really weird one day just fell off and I took off my hoodie. I was in the garage working and my son was there and was like dude! Dad! What is on your arm? I was like, What? Yeah, I had that telltale bullseye rash there. I didn't know what it was at the time. And so I ended up going to the I went to the hospital at night just because it was a Saturday or something. And so and the doctor was closed. But I always go to get checked out. I felt kind of silly going to the hospital. I got a rash.

Rob Thiessen:
We missed that. There was a little glitch on the Internet. Your son said to dad and then what?

Zach Hillman:
My son saw the weird rash on my arm. And I was like, I don't know what it is. So he went, He's a Gen Z guy. So he goes and gets this phone, and it's like our computer and was Googling rashes. And I think you have Lyme disease, Dad. That's a Lyme disease rash. I said, What's Lyme disease? So anyways, I ended up going to the doctor and they're kind of weird. They're all taking pictures of it and like, Wow, I've never seen this in person before, so great. Glad it's amusing, but ended up on a very long, weird, painful journey. Still just it's a very odd disease in that the symptoms are just weird because it's basically the bacteria just attacks your nervous system, your brain, and messes up, causing havoc all over. So which is why it's so hard to diagnose if you don't know what you're fighting? Because it's like every day, wake up, What's today going to be? Oh, okay, it's going to be this kind of day. I'm going to have like weird stuff as in like, you know the feeling you get when your hands asleep, you know, I have like my elbows down would be asleep for days on end. That's, that's weird. It's so annoying that kind of stuff for another day. I just be totally just I couldn't describe it other than it feels like your body is just kind of screaming, you know? It just you get it's just a very debilitating. And so that was about a, that was about a year of I was just kind of good days and bad days for I'm doing I'm feeling much better now but my energy is still pretty low. I'm still pretty tired a lot. And so but I passed all the weird stuff. So hopefully I can get past it all, all the weird symptoms that I was experiencing. But that's actually what they say about it's about a year. You can expect different symptoms like that as your body works through it. So that's been a strange journey going through that.

Rob Thiessen:
Well Zach that kind of stuff, you know, just for our listeners and community to know as we pray for you and remember you and Cheryl and your family over there and your little family farm with your goats. By the way, I've watched a couple of your preaching things during COVID, where you are preaching out in the woods and you take your phone out there and you give people a message online from either your backyard. I watch the one with your goats there a little bit and you're talking about being a shepherd and here's how the goats behave. And this is what life is like. It's really awesome and captivating and, you know, also just creative that you're saying, hey, you know, this fits our community. Let's talk from the beauty of Port Alberni and just yeah, so that's been amazing. Also, a little late this afternoon at 1:00, we've got Island Prayer with the pastors. What has that meant to you? Like, you talked about the financial support, but you've also I think there's something really good and unique over there in the island. Tell us about the island prayer gathering.

Zach Hillman:
Yeah. So, yeah, coming from a large church, I'm used to if you get a weird email or a weird phone call, you just go to the office next door. Hey, man, what do you think about this? What should we. And I don't have that as much here.

Rob Thiessen:
But you don't have the weird emails?

Zach Hillman:
In a way we do with the. No, no, no, no, no. I get the emails.

Rob Thiessen:
Okay. Okay. You just don't.

Zach Hillman:
I have. I don't have the office camaraderie. And the I.

Rob Thiessen:
No, pastors escape the weird emails.

Zach Hillman:
No.

Rob Thiessen:
That's pretty much common about this perk.

Zach Hillman:
Yeah and so it's been fantastic where if I have something, a crisis happens or what should I do about this? I'll send a text to one of the guys in the island or and that's been, that's been basically our, my support group. Very much so as far as and getting it. And Brian's been great and helping us get together every month just this time of prayer, which is a great way to stay connected. And so for me, it really it's kind of to me, I see it as kind of a, I shouldn't say, staff, but it really is that kind of extended staff kind of feel to it as far as, hey, I have a question about this. What do you think about this? Or I would actually even more Bryan's organizing right now and we do different things. We're trying to preach to each other's churches and just share the ministry together. So I've loved it. And when I've had again, I've called folks when I had a question, I've had people call me and it's been it's been great. And on holidays I'll go to other churches just to visit. And likewise, many have been to my church as well. It's a nice community out here because we need that. It's been great. And yeah, so I've been very thankful and appreciative of the community out here.

Rob Thiessen:
Well, that's great, Zach. It's great to have a conversation. I know there we could talk a lot more about ministry there, but for all of our listeners and stuff, I, you know, I just, I hope that you've enjoyed the opportunity to just journey a little bit here of Zach's story. Zach and Sheryl and their family and Port Alberni is a beautiful place. And I know over the summer, in years gone by, various churches have sent teams out to work with you guys in the summer for camps. And I can imagine now coming out of COVID that that would be an option, too. If churches want to contact you and say, how could we help? Over the years, various churches have come out to help with a building or repairs or just trying to come alongside for a short stint to bring encouragement and of course, funding. That's been greatly appreciated. So for listeners, keep Zach and Cheryl in mind, bring them before the Lord. And if the Lord leads you in some way to encourage them, please do. And for all of us, we've taken some lessons of faith from hearing your journeys Zach. And may the Lord help us all to look at our community with fresh eyes and to see how we can just come alongside people form community. Be good friends. And have faith to believe that even through hard times that God is using it to build his church. Now. So take care, Zach. Yeah, I'll see you later at the time, at one.

Zach Hillman:
All right. Sounds good.

Rob Thiessen:
Yeah. To all of our listeners. It's been good to spend this hour again with you and look forward to catching up on the next podcast.

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