#49 - A Church Turnaround Story ft. Matt Glezos & John Koehn

BCMB 049 - A Church Turnaround Story.mp3: Audio automatically transcribed by Sonix

BCMB 049 - A Church Turnaround Story.mp3: this mp3 audio file was automatically transcribed by Sonix with the best speech-to-text algorithms. This transcript may contain errors.

John Koehn:
People want to be part of something bigger, you know? You know, people wear name brand clothes, because they're putting themselves with something, you know? And so he says, and I think churches are like that, too.

Matt Glezos:
We tried to prioritize, what we see the Bible prioritize in terms of who the church should be, the people on on mission for the sake of Christ. So our mission statement was just the same as Westside's, because it always seemed to me to be very clear, we exist to make Jesus known. That was, drilled into us in a good way from the Westside leadership.

Intro:
Welcome to the BCMB podcast, pastor to pastor. This is a podcast by the British Columbia Conference of Mennonite Brethren Churches. We want to help equip and encourage pastors, churches, and anyone else who wants to listen in and be more effective in their ministry. This is episode 49, A Church Turnaround Story with Matt Glezos and John Koehns.

Rob Thiessen:
We are persevering. Hey everybody! Rob Thiessen here with the BCMB Pastor to Pastor podcast take three today. Having a little technical difficulty, but hopefully you can all hear and just adjust the mic here for all of us. But I am delighted to be here in Port Coquitlam this morning with my guest, Matt Glezos, and John Koehn, pastor and lay leader at the Tri-City church. And we're here to tell the story to encourage us in an exciting story of church renewal, and also for us as pastors and leaders, just to put our thoughts together, to open up our hearts to how God might teach us something from this chapter in our own churches for renewal. So I usually start the podcast with inviting a guest to introduce themselves and tell us a little bit about the community that shaped them, how the Lord led them into the ministry that they're involved in. So, Matt, why don't you get us started again?

Matt Glezos:
Absolutely. Uh, my faith journey, begins, in my teen years, my neighbours went to Willingdon Church in Burnaby, an MB church there. I did not grow up in a believing household, but was invited to youth group and, from there heard the gospel. Also heard it at a Christian camp, Timberline Ranch in Maple Ridge. But really, it was Willingdon where my faith grew, where I was introduced to the things of God and to the gospel and Christ himself. And so from the age of, I think, about 13 or 14 onward, I was, going to church gatherings every Sunday with, my friend Keith's, family and part of the youth group there, and ended up being on staff there. So that that really was how I came to faith. There were other factors early on. Didn't realize I had Christian neighbors who were praying for me and that sort of thing. But in terms of when I really. Yeah, started living life as a follower of Christ, it was in my teen years.

Rob Thiessen:
Yeah, yeah. That's excellent. I think the recording we did last - did you go to Moscrop Highschool as well?

Matt Glezos:
Uh, no, I was here in the Tri-Cities, grew up here. So I was, I was not there, but obviously knew of the Moscrop was always a presence there down the way from Willingdon. Yeah.

Rob Thiessen:
It's funny just to hear that, you know, commonality of, experience that our listeners know that's my church that I grew up in to and influenced my life a lot, too. And, John, you also have that in common. So tell the community a little bit about your story.

John Koehn:
So John Koehn, I grew up in a Christian home and with parents that were quite involved in the church, and probably my first beginnings was when we did sod turning to build Willingdon. You know, that's when church life became a little bit. And when I think back of people who might have directed me a little bit, I was my dad's friend, Henry Jansen. I when I was younger, I used to avoid him a little because he would come up in church and tap you on the shoulder and say, wow, how's your Christian walk? You know, what is the Lord done in your life this week? And we already saw him coming and their brains were turning. But anyhow, from there we were got involved in Willingdon. I went to Bible school and came back. And I still remember when.

Rob Thiessen:
Where did you go to Bible school, John?

John Koehn:
CBI. Yeah Columbia Bible Institute.

Rob Thiessen:
Used to be CBI. Yeah.

John Koehn:
And, I still, remember, when we were going to start Coquitlam Church and it was Ted Klassen, and I was talking with my dad, and he says, well, you know, I give you my blessing to move on. He says, you know, I was involved with starting Willingdon. And so there's a start. And so I'm willing to give Ted $50,000 to go start a church. And that was probably the whole input of Willingdon at that time. And going off you went.

Matt Glezos:
Yeah. What year was that?

John Koehn:
When we started here, I would guess it's around 30 years ago. Yeah.

Rob Thiessen:
50 Grand was a lot 30 years ago. Yeah.

Rob Thiessen:
Oh, man.

Rob Thiessen:
So but there was a building here. Uh, tell us a little bit about that.

John Koehn:
Okay. The this particular building had nothing to do with the start. You know, just to clarify how we got started. You know, I guess we've kind of grown up that a building should be part of the church, right? You know, and it was a lot of work setting up. And, you know, it's always the faithful few who do the setup and take down.

Rob Thiessen:
And where and where was that?

John Koehn:
Terry Fox High School, the old one. Okay. Yeah. And and so when the church got going, we looked for property. You know, I was always looking for something. And I remember there was an empty building on, Lougheed Highway. And I said, you know, there's a building we should maybe look into it. And so, they gave me the okay to go and look into it. And long and short of it is the elders and our pastor, we walked to that building seven times. We walked around it and prayed for it and dedicated that property. And then I went and talked with the owner and he says, well, I can't do anything about it. But he says, because there's an auction on it. But he says, if you sign up, an agreement, then I can push the other guy. And the other guy ended up taking it.

Matt Glezos:
So you didn't get the building?

John Koehn:
We did not get the building, but the person who bought it renovated the whole thing and had different businesses. And every business that went in there went bankrupt. And eventually a Chinese church bought that building. And it's a church to this day. You know, so I was that was interesting. But, you know, we tried different and we eventually we bought a ministry center and so we could have our youth there and different group meetings and stuff like that. And then Ted had his office in there.

Matt Glezos:
So is this all under, was it Hyde Creek Church from the beginning?

John Koehn:
That Hyde Creek Church from the beginning. Yeah.

Rob Thiessen:
What about the beginning of this location? Tell us a little bit how that unfolded.

John Koehn:
Well, there was, just let me go just back. There was one highlight that we had, and it was our biggest church growth was when we bought a piece of property up on Burke Mountain. And our church really grew that, you know, people sometimes say, well, you know, people don't like debt and they want to, but it was the the opposite for us, the long and the short. We never did get to build on it. It became the headwaters of Hyde Creek, even after we'd had environmental people come and check it and give us the okay. And it was a piece of property, actually, the city had chosen for us and said, we will approve a church on there. And it never it never worked out, never worked out.

Matt Glezos:
So then while you were trying to sort that out, this building which we're in now, which is Mary Hill Baptist.

John Koehn:
Actually the fellow from the Baptist conference started coming to this church with Hyde Creek. We were renting it. We were renting it from the Baptist. And so, you know, over time I started pushing and said, well, maybe the Baptist should sell it to us. But our church was floundering a little bit, with not having a home, you know, and anyhow, and we still had the other property. And, you know, the guy said, you know, the board of elders said, well, we really you know, we have a piece of property which we have any issues with and to buy another building. But I kind of stayed after it, and tried to figure out how this building could pay for itself while we still used it. And so we, we eventually had the whole, like we rented it from the Baptist conference, but we had control of the whole building. And so we started we had an afternoon church, a Chinese church that arrived or came after us, and we had, the Toronto Conservatory music came and used it. And so it paid more.

Rob Thiessen:
You were able to cover the costs?

John Koehn:
All the costs of it.

Rob Thiessen:
Yeah, yeah.

John Koehn:
And so when. So then I suggested we should really buy this building. And the conference was actually, uh, looking at next door, the builders were wanting the property, and so they put an offer in, and then the conference told us we'd have to match the developer's offer and we could still make ends meet. So that's how we got into it. Yeah.

Rob Thiessen:
Well, there's something unique about this location. Like when you drive in there, if you can even find the place, which is tricky. Thankfully, you've got a sign out there on the road pit river road. But it's really like a fishbowl of a church because it's kind of.

Matt Glezos:
It's nestled in.

John Koehn:
It's a community.

Rob Thiessen:
Yeah.

Rob Thiessen:
And there's a subdivisions all around.

Matt Glezos:
And that's because the church was originally built, my understanding before most of the houses were here. Is that correct?

John Koehn:
It was before. Yes. And the property next door where the new houses.

Matt Glezos:
1971.

John Koehn:
That was, owned by the Catholics. Right. Okay. And, uh, so there was two church properties side by side.

Matt Glezos:
Now it's just surrounded by houses.

John Koehn:
The road changed. The road was supposed to come this way, and they built the roads farther.

Rob Thiessen:
Okay. So logistics aside of the place and the story, which is an interesting story and it's not insignificant. You know, like you said, what churches do with properties and locations is a factor in how they grow and sometimes even the struggle and owning two properties that cause a lot of tension and stress on a church. But what were some of the, what were some of the vision? I know Ted, he was an evangelist like Ted, loved to see people come to Christ. And he often he passed away just a couple of years ago. But Ted was well known at Willingdon and all over BC for, you know, being very outspoken about sharing the Lord with people boldly. Did the church where was there fruit in those early days for the church? How would you describe that that?

John Koehn:
We were, once Terry Fox built a new building. We actually went into their theater. And that was a big improvement over putting, covering gym floors and putting chairs out and stuff like that. But, I think back, He allowed the young people in the church to preach, you know, and I think back and I know he got my son to preach once in a while and so the church packed out the Sundays he would speak and it would be, he was at Simon Fraser. And so he would tell his friends or put it out on Facebook or whatever he did and said he was preaching at church. And so the kids from school would come, and a lot of his friends, they wouldn't come, but they would send their girlfriends or stuff like that. And, you know, and I think back of how many, you know, college age students would come during those days. And I think Ted liked that part, too. And he would, you know, he got involved with the school and coaching and stuff like that.

Rob Thiessen:
Yeah. So that was really a part of the vision, of the church, Hyde Creek. Now my time getting involved. We want to get to the story of what's happened here currently and what the Lord is doing, and talk with Matt a little bit about that process. But there was a season where the church was, like, let's say plateaued or even in decline. And, you know, there's various reasons why those things happen. And, you know, hindsight is always 20/20. But, you know, how would you describe the place, like, what got you as a church to a place where you said where you were willing to consider, like a replant or a complete restart? John, how did that how did that unfold?

John Koehn:
Well, it didn't start that way a little bit. How it started was, I think we can't keep going on the way it is, you know. And so now there's a value on, on the property and stuff like that. And so, you know, there were different scenarios came up. And, you know, the Alliance Church really wanted it. They said, you know, we'll take it. And, you know, there was a few of us that were from Mennonite background on the board and we said, well, if we were giving it away, we would give it to a Mennonite church or whatever. And so one of them came up was the Chinese. I don't think they ever knew that they were in consideration. But the Chinese church in Port Coquitlam, or in Port Moody and, I said I'd rather just give it to them. You know, I says, I don't want to sell the property because it's too hard to rezone properties to get churches, especially in Coquitlam at the time. And, so that's how that kind of started. Then we had Eldon that had come and yeah.

Rob Thiessen:
He was a transitional pastor.

John Koehn:
And he pushed the idea of that people want to be part of something bigger, you know? You know, people wear brand, name brand clothes, because they're putting themselves with something, you know, and so he says, and I think churches are like that, too. And so, we talked with Willingdon and we talked with Northview, and then we talked with Willingdon again. And Willingdon was having their own issues at the time. And so, Northview was very hesitant when we said we wanted to do that. And, yeah. And so eventually they said, well, why doesn't Willingdon want to do it? And I said, well, you know, it's they just don't have the foresight for that right now. And so that's how Northview got involved.

Rob Thiessen:
Yeah. Well that's a conversation I've had before with churches in our denominational family. So when a church is looking at adopting another church I've had pastors ask me that question. So what exactly is wrong with this church that you're offering to us? And it's a little bit of a weird conversation, right? It's like we're shopping around, we're dating or something. We're trying to find a new partner to help. And I recall like that Aldon did, you know, help the church go into a transitional time where you are looking at options and the transitional time. Having a transitional pastor, allows a bit of freedom. It's not, the pastor is a consultant, and the pastor is not really, it's not like you have. Oh, this is our pastor, and now we're talking about him being out of a job. And this is all reflecting badly on him. When the transitional pastor comes in, all that pressure is off. It's just like, oh, this guy here's a consultant. He just helps us to figure out the best pathway forward. So it really gives you a window where there isn't that, you know, all of the, the personal dynamics that are with a pastor who served a number of years, people just, like, heartbroken. And it's a tough place for a church to come to let go. It really is. And, you know, some churches just, you know, will say, well, you know, we just want to die here. We just want to die here. Which of course isn't, you know, not really a great option for the body of Christ.

Matt Glezos:
I'm so thankful that John and the leadership at the time, I mean, this property could easily be more houses, the city. A lot of people would have been very easy to do that. Or, like you said, just a pass off. But it seemed like there's a real desire for the gospel to be proclaimed, continually here in this part of the world, right where your heart was or your family's were.

Rob Thiessen:
Even that willingness to say, well, we'll give it away to somebody, just so that Ministry continues, displays the the heart that says, all right, God, we're going to put this seed into the ground. We're willing to see it die so that something new could happen again. And that's a very courageous step of leadership. And then something new did start to come together. So, let's talk a little bit about that. Northview, got involved. Crossridge got involved. And then, Matt, you were working on church planting at the time.

Matt Glezos:
Yeah. So that season, my story with this, I guess building, you would say, begins sort of after what John said. So coming into it, I didn't know really any of the history that had happened here. Personally, I had been on a journey, my wife and I both have of sensing a call to planting. I had been at Willingdon for about five years, even longer. But as a pastor of children's ministry there, I had thought I would be a teacher. Was teaching in the Coquitlam school district, felt called into ministry, was at Willingdon for a while, and then a transition from there to Westside and at Westside. Unbeknownst to us, we experienced sort of our apprenticeship in church planting because at that time, Westside was planting a campus on North Vancouver. We were part of that. We were able to see, Christ City begin also. And so it was never something that was on my radar until we were in it. And that was hugely influential to see Norm's leadership and just the desire for multiplication. So as we began to wrestle with some of that, we discerned a call, went through the see to see church planting apprenticeship, which was very helpful. We ended up leaving Westside at the time, Westside elders weren't quite sure what to do with me, and I wasn't quite sure what to do with me.

Matt Glezos:
We felt this call to the Tri-Cities, where I grew up, but no one saw a clear way forward. So, the role of C2C was instrumental because it gave us a year of apprenticeship, which we spent at Crossridge. Lee Francois, we knew each other from Willingdon. And during that year I was thinking, like John was describing, I was looking at school gyms. I was thinking, all right, we're going to plant a church. There aren't in my mind that any buildings available that that I knew of, I knew of this building, had had been by it, had been praying about it, but just didn't know what the status was. And so I found out that Northview had taken over the building and was planning on planting. That was my first initial. Oh, something's happening. And, through I'm not sure who talked with them and found, you know, I asked, do you have someone to lead it? And they they were looking for someone. And so we began to talk. So it was a it was a combination of conversations, which is I think sometimes how these things go, you're not sure exactly what God is doing. And yet, you're trying to be faithful to what God has called you to personally. And others are doing the same. So Northview had a sense of, I hear from John a bit of trepidation.

Matt Glezos:
Are we going to take on this thing? Okay, we feel a call to plant but didn't have all the details. I was feeling a call to plant, didn't have all the details, and the Lord was moving the pieces around the game board. So when we were in conversation, I was trying to figure out, you know. What is this? What is Northview's vision for this? Does it match up with mine? That was part of the conversation. And as we began to talk, I was realized, that while Northview had the resources and they would readily admit this to, you know, handle the church plant, really, a church plant is about the people. It's I mean, the building is helpful. But what was very clear from what I saw with Westside, uh, in terms of the way they multiplied, is it really is about a core group of people, ideally. Not always. You know, sometimes you go into a region where you start from scratch and God obviously blesses that as well. But I saw real fruitfulness from some of the North Shore campus plant where a group of people who had a season of training, a season of equipping, being really clear on why we're doing this. We don't just want to be closer to our houses, drive less. It's not about that. It's not about the practical issues. It's about the opportunities that exist when you are in your community as a church, proclaiming the gospel, living the gospel.

Matt Glezos:
And so, my comment to Northview was, you know, maybe we should talk with Crossridge and Westside because they have people here. I knew there were people that were traveling to those churches, and perhaps there could be a partnership. And so the leadership of the few churches began to talk. And that is eventually kind of what was discerned. Hey, this could work really well. They all brought different components, to the table in a sense. And there was a, you know, the things that made it work was real, crystal clear mission. The reason why was very clear. It's for the sake of the gospel. And there was a high degree of agreement on, you know, the core theological issues and even some of the secondary ones. So we knew the three churches the way they did church gatherings. View of preaching, view of ministry, philosophy was very similar. So it worked well to work together. And that was the, I guess when those pieces came into place, we started moving forward with that vision for what became Tri-City church. So, there's a lot more to tell there, but that's essentially, looking back, a beautiful thing that none of us really were thinking would happen or had a vision for initially.

Rob Thiessen:
And there's a there's an interesting loop back that, that both Crossridge and Westside were churches, that were heavily impacted by Willingdon. Also like both all those leaders came out of those churches. That's correct. And Willingdon for many, many years didn't really, embrace a church planting mentality. But what what happened was they raised up a lot of leaders, and the leaders left and planted churches. Yes. And, they kind of still continue. I mean, Willingdon sort of has its own, sort of field to work in there and continues to spin off, leaders and people. But it all comes around in a circle. So it's really a blessing that way. Now thinking about that first year, John, from your perspective with the changes that happened and I don't know how many stayed, maybe you can tell us a little bit about that, but how did how did how did you experience such a radical shift. Like what were some of the hurdles in that first year, when Matt's leadership came and all of a sudden it's a different animal, a different church. How did, what were some of the challenges?

John Koehn:
For myself, you know, I've never taught I don't think I've told Matt this, but I have children that went with Matt and were in Matt's Bible study before and they said, if this is before, Northview had chosen anybody and they were actually interviewing ten different people, and I would see different people coming in the parking lot. And I'd go ask them, what are you doing here? And then they said, well, you know, we're sitting here praying to see if we can be the pastor here, you know, and that was interesting. But anyhow, I told Steve from Northview there, I said, you know, if you get Matt Glezos to be the pastor here, I'll pay extra. He just laughed.

Matt Glezos:
I don't know if I got that money.

John Koehn:
Yeah, yeah. Not to me.

John Koehn:
And my thinking behind him was selfish because my kid said, wherever Matt goes, that's where we're going. And I thought, oh, I've never had kids that have gone to church, into the church where I go. And I like that idea. And so that's just on the side.

Matt Glezos:
It was a big change for you though, right, John? Because you were really, in a sense, you and Denise holding a lot of things together practically. Right? I mean, keeping the building going. And then that must have been. Was that hard to let go?

John Koehn:
No. We were, we let go easy. Yeah.

Matt Glezos:
That's what it looked like. You I mean there wasn't a, there wasn't a tug of war at all, which I was so thankful for.

Rob Thiessen:
What about, for some of the others. Was it hard for some of the others?

John Koehn:
Not that many stayed, actually. And I think we only had one other couple that actually stayed from the original. Yeah, because there was a time space in between.

Speaker5:
Who was the fellow who was your moderator before?

John Koehn:
Dave.

Rob Thiessen:
Dave sure. Yeah.

Rob Thiessen:
We met numbers of times.

John Koehn:
Yeah.

Matt Glezos:
But there's about a year. Is that is that right? When the doors were kind of closed, like people would necessarily when.

John Koehn:
It was over a year. And so people got involved in other churches. And, you know, and it's just the way it went, the way it was.

Rob Thiessen:
You guys had some renovations here in the place, obviously.

John Koehn:
Well it stayed empty with no reservation or anything. And then for, I don't know, six to eight months and then they started the renovation.

Matt Glezos:
Yeah. And that was.

John Koehn:
Yeah. But the transition for me or for, I think was relatively easy because we just accepted that's how it was. But we had, you know, a year and a half to think about it.

Rob Thiessen:
Yeah. Yeah.

Matt Glezos:
I think that's one of the things that as you were saying, Rob, that the challenge of existing leadership at a point where maybe there's some decline and the question of what to do, it you know, when there's some life left, it's tough to know what's the best way forward. Right? In some ways, it was clearer just because of the way things were here when we came in, we didn't feel like we were actually displacing, or it was a blank slate in a sense, which in some ways made it easier. But of course, then, as you said, John, the people weren't around. So there's kind of some pros and cons, but, there is I think, a clarity that comes from saying this is a new thing. We're beginning, that is helpful, you might say easier, maybe not always the best, but that was our story.

Rob Thiessen:
Yeah, yeah.

John Koehn:
And Northview wanted that. They said they wanted the clear. You know, so because they didn't want to have anybody saying, well, this is what we did before.

Rob Thiessen:
Right, right. Yeah.

Rob Thiessen:
There is definitely an added layer of complexity if you have existing group. And in a future podcast, we'll do one with North Langley and the Bethel leaders. Right. Because they had a bit more of an existing congregation. You have to navigate that. People have feelings and, you know, and, and so, uh, but you started with a clean slate. So what are some of the ways, Matt, share with us, like that you saw God begin to work. What were your initial priorities for you as you know, a new pastor, a new team? What what did you prioritize, in the life of the church during that first year, that first season?

Matt Glezos:
I mean, I think I we tried to prioritize, what we see the Bible prioritize in terms of who the church should be. People on on mission for the sake of Christ. So our mission statement was just the same as Westsides, because it always seemed to me to be very clear, we exist to make Jesus known. That was drilled into us in a good way from the Westside leadership that that there is, that the mission that we're on is the mission of God, and we get to be part of what he's doing, and we should expect it to be difficult, but we should also expect it to be satisfying and life giving. And so the beginning stage we were able to do, I think from the January of 2017, towards the summer, we were able to do pre-launch gatherings where that's really what we talked about. Why are we here? What are we about? What do we see in the Bible in terms of the way that, you know, a healthy church operates in terms of, you know, not just correct doctrine, but correct living, you know, speaking truth and love. We tried to paint a picture of what we see in the New Testament church and call people to this.

Matt Glezos:
And what we found was that people in this area were really looking for that, there is a, you know, like I said a moment a go. There are people who are driving down the Westside or Crossridge. They formed our sort of initial launch team, so we maybe had, by the end of that pre-launch time. So the summer of 2017, you know, we had about 75 people who signed up for a surf team. That was my metric. You know, a lot of people came out and we had, you know, gatherings we had meals. We tried, we had prayer walks. We had a ways to try to get some traction and build a culture of gospel focus. But then at the end of the day, it was, okay, who's going to when we're starting in September, who's going to be here? There were lots of people. We did renos. People came and did demos. So there was people putting, you know, sort of their hands to the plow in a sense. But that was encouraging for me to see that there were, I think, 75, whatever you want to say, family units who said, no, we want to serve. We want to.

Rob Thiessen:
What kind of service teams? What did that look like? What did you, what did they sign up for?

Matt Glezos:
So the I'm trying to think what they were, you know, very practically, we tried to break it down just in terms of on a Sunday morning, we see the the Sunday morning gathering as obviously mandated, the sort of part of the healthy church rhythms, but also, I think still in our culture, which whatever you want to say it is, post-Christian or, you know, a religious culture, people still associate religious practice, faith, Christian faith with a Sunday morning gathering, I think. And so in my experience, you need to make sure that you think that through. Well, for the sake of our own people and for those that are coming. So we knew we needed a kids ministry. We wanted it to be effective and fun. By effective, I mean like it runs well, but also effective in terms of connecting kids to Christ and to the gospel. We wanted to be hospitable. So we're going to have a cafe team where we're going to have, you know, just the practical coffee, had to put in coffee machines, those kinds of things. Parking team. Welcome, team. Ben Gadd was on part time with Westside. He and I knew each other from there as a worship and in charge of tech at Westside. And so he felt the call. And so he actually worked, he moved out here.

Matt Glezos:
There's a house that's on the church property. He and his family moved. So he and I were kind of the first, I guess you'd say staff. But he developed, you know, got the whoever the musicians were together, we knew we wanted to have vibrant, genuine sort of worship that would lead people to sing praises to God. So, you know, it's sort of practical things, but rooted in the theological convictions, the things that we see in terms of the ecclesiology, who is the church, who are we to be, and what would be effective for reaching our community? That's part of the reason we did renovations, not just because we wanted new paint on the wall, but just because it says something about a place when you walk in the door and and it feels fresh, right. It's not that that will save people. It's just we wanted to communicate a sense of life. And so all of those things put together, we hoped would be effective for reaching the community with the heart in our people of, it's up to each all of us. We are the missionaries. We are going to invite people and then when we launched, hopefully everything works well in a practical way so that it's, you know, people have a sense that we care deeply about what's going on.

Rob Thiessen:
So the Sunday morning gathering. Yeah. Was an important part, a big rock for this witness.

Matt Glezos:
Yeah. Sunday morning and then the few other things we had was a youth group, Jane Amanda Koehn, who I knew from Willingdon. Also, they had done youth for years and they said, we'll start up youth group. We started every other week on Tuesdays, we had help. Northview was, I mean, helpful in so many ways. But one of the ways is their youth team would come and help support us. We did a kids club, once a month, when the Northview kids team would come and help us to start that, and we had community groups or life groups. Again, the value of having people sort of part of the plant team who are from existing churches, we had vetted leaders who were community group leaders. We could start, our first Sunday with, I think we had four community groups. So we were able to hit the ground running in terms of operating and connecting people with what we think are life giving.

Rob Thiessen:
Relationships.

Matt Glezos:
Relationships and ways to grow. Yeah. So the Sunday morning was a key aspect of it. But we were trying to fill in the other, we thought essential parts of church life.

Rob Thiessen:
What would you say now, what do you think people in this neighborhood think about this church? Have you picked up on a sensor like, is it obviously the visibility of gathering here? I mean, the other, you know, again, because you're in a fishbowl place, the parking lot fills up. And I thought, boy, everybody, every neighbour must look at this. And I wonder, do they do they hate you for the parking? I mean, that was a Willingdon's problem all the time.

Rob Thiessen:
The neighbours like what are they doing parking our streets up every Sunday? But what do they think about this place, as far as you can tell? And what do you hope they'll think about this community in the years to come?

Matt Glezos:
Well, we hope that they will think of us as people who are in love with Christ, saved by Jesus. That the gospel that people would see, there's a spiritual life here that comes through Jesus. So I don't know what you know. It's tough to know exactly what they think.

John Koehn:
But I think what helps is that Ben lives in this house here. And he has a feel for the community. Yeah. You know, he has the kids come using the parking lot and his kids are out there, so I think that makes a big difference. We used to get complaints when we were here before because there was glass and there was open windows always. So our music would go out. And so they thought it was the music was too loud in Sunday mornings. Right? I don't know if we've gotten complaints like that.

Matt Glezos:
Only 1 or 2 over the last little while, but that is that is very true. Having Ben and his family here has been so helpful because he is the face, like our neighbors know Ben and so they know he works at the church. And so, I mean, there's always a bit of friction when all of a sudden there's, you know, hundreds of cars driving through what, what for a while was very quiet area. But I know there's I mean, we've tried to like John was saying, we've built ramps. Ben has built bike trails and swings, and we have basketball hoops. When it's nice out the community, like we've we've tried to, you know, show that kind of open door policy, which I think is I think has been well received.

Rob Thiessen:
Halloween?

Matt Glezos:
We do some we do some fireworks which.

Speaker5:
Just burned any houses down?

Matt Glezos:
No, we don't do that. Right. And our goal there is simply to connect with the neighbours again. We try to make it. I mean, really, our big things are Christmas and Easter. We have signage out Christmas Eve. We try to be visible in that way and try.

Rob Thiessen:
Have people come at Christmas?

Matt Glezos:
Yeah. Christmas Eve is always our biggest Sunday of the year.

John Koehn:
5 services or 6.

Matt Glezos:
Yeah, yeah, we did five services last year and yeah. People still in our culture, people Christmas Eve is still a thing that, if you're invited you tend to come. And so we want to make the most of that.

Rob Thiessen:
What are you going to do this year? Christmas Eve on Sunday.

Matt Glezos:
We're going to do our three gatherings in the morning and then two in the afternoon. And we're going to just do all the same service, Christmas Eve service. And we really see those Sundays. I mean, we hope that every Sunday is has an evangelistic component, but that is we see an opportunity to to preach the gospel in a really clear way. Yeah, we know there's lots of visitors and that's great.

Rob Thiessen:
Thinking, down the road from, just the people, the visibility, the attraction of a community that's alive, a family, and that's not insignificant. I mean we, you know, I remember at North Langley, one of the families that came to church from the neighbourhood, they had been watching. It was the Hichmann's who lived across the street from them. And they probably watched him for a couple of years, but they just could not figure out what was it with that family and their kids? Because they seem normal. They seemed happy. And they were going somewhere on Sunday. And that's all it took, you know for them, this family was curious and it's not always low hanging fruit like that. But just being here worshiping and carrying the rhythms of life does bear witness. God uses it amazingly like that. But what about the journey towards Christ likeness? What does that look like now? You've been running for a few years. What sort of what sort of plans have you put in place to help people continue to grow towards maturity in Christ? How are you thinking about that, Matt?

Matt Glezos:
We try to think of it, I guess, in terms of just different opportunities for discipleship, different ways to to help people to grow. We see that as sort of the pattern, right, of the New Testament church that there's a gospel proclamation that people would come to know Christ and then that they would grow in that way. So our community groups, our small groups, I guess we'd say is, is sort of the backbone of that in the sense that we as people, if you're new, certainly if you're a new believer and you know wondering what do I do next? I'm here on a Sunday morning. We say you should join a group. We're not meant to do this alone. And so we have, you know, Tim, who is on staff and leads the community groups. Really his job is to recruit and train leaders. We have an apprenticeship program within the group. So we're looking for others who might want to start other groups. And it's not the only way, but that's one of the primary ways, is that you can be in relationship with someone who knows you beyond the lobby conversations and hopefully can push, can apply the truths that we're hearing on Sunday morning.

Matt Glezos:
So we also have men and women's Bible studies very similar, you know, a little bit of different emphasis but similar goal that we would recognize that the Word of God is life giving and authoritative. And if we love each other, well, we're going to be helping each other to apply it and maybe asking each other about how things are going. Not maybe, we will be, but maybe asking some uncomfortable questions and seeking to encourage and lead people in that way. So we see that as integral. I mean, it is integral to the Christian life. And our hope is that, you know, like I'm sure many local churches, our hope is that people can't be here for long without feeling that they're missing something if they're not in part, or that people are asking, or that people are inviting and that it's a genuine sense of life and faith. Not superficial, not partial, but it's I mean. The success of that is, of course, difficult to measure. I mean, we're encouraged always by the stories we hear and by the people that we know. But it's like all of us, there's different seasons of growth.

Rob Thiessen:
What are some of the stories that encourage you, that have built up your faith? Some of the highlights of how God has been at work in the lives of people.

Matt Glezos:
Well we have had neighbours who, as you said, have walked through the doors, and have begun faith journeys. We've had, we've had people come to faith and be baptized here. I mean, that's the greatest encouragement. I mean, you never quite know who's going to walk through the door. It's amazing how often people, you know, say Google is our friend, right? How did you find your way here? I just googled the church, and I walked in here and praise God. So. So you know, I don't know how many we baptized over the years, but there have been, it's always the stories of new believers. We have a few women from Iran who are who are here who had, one had come to faith prior to being here. The other one came to faith while she was here. And to see them to come to know Christ in a life saving way is so encouraging. But I also look to, I mean, we have young people who are taking steps of genuine faith. We have a great youth program, that are, I think, really seeking to edify, like to teach them the things of God and have them walk in it. So it's the work of ministry, as you know, Rob its encouraging and challenging, like it's at the same time.

Matt Glezos:
So there's always reason to feel weary in a sense, because, uh, you feel like maybe nothing is happening. And yet there's always, not always, there's often, you know, if you're in conversation, you can see the work of the Lord that he is doing through the preached word. I mean, I think that is clearly a, you know, a focal point and but also through the words of the people in the church who are in conversation and who are again proclaiming the gospel in more relational ways. So there yeah, there's been great stories. We're so thankful to see the growth. But we're hungry for more, frankly. I mean, you know, part of the Tri-City story is that there was a need here in this community. But we would love to see more people come to Christ. There's a lot of, our numbers are a lot of people who are just looking for a church home, looking for a certain theological convictions, and we're glad for that. But what we really hunger for are more evangelistic stories of people coming to faith.

Rob Thiessen:
Right.

John Koehn:
And so when we started just going back a bit, but when we first started, Coquitlam or the Tri-City area was the most unchurched area in all of Canada. Really? Yeah. I think it was like 2%. Really? Yeah. And so that's why Ted wanted to start one in this area. Yeah. And since we're on, we're going to be on. Are we looking for a youth pastor?

Matt Glezos:
Yes we are looking for a youth pastor? Yes. Thank you for bringing that up, John. That's right. Yeah. David has been leading the youth still is. But he's also doing other things. And so yeah, we're looking for a youth minister. And I think that is one of the challenges is leadership, leadership pipeline as I'm sure Rob talking to other like that's, I mean, he's done a great job of that in their program. David Kelso, who's our youth guy. He went through the Northview Immerse program, which was a fantastic way. And we're looking for more of that as well. But, you know, our desire, the hunger that I speak about, requires, you know, men who are feeling called to preach the gospel and go and plant churches and their families along with them. And so all of that requires an investment where we're trying to do some of that. Those are some of the things that as a young church, we're trying to get going, but definitely looking to others who have got that kind of pipeline already going. But I think that's essential. Right. We need to be training up.

Rob Thiessen:
Yeah, yeah.

Rob Thiessen:
When I was visiting here the other Sunday, I was impressed to see quite a diversity of you know, ethnicities here. Lots of children. Good demographic. Yeah, yeah. That's exciting. Speaks of health in the future.

Matt Glezos:
Yeah. And I think that I mean, if the implicit question is, was there any strategy there? Uh, no. Hopefully, I think a healthy church will reflect the community. And so that's always been our mindset is that if our people as a church, we are actually seeking to make Jesus known in our lives and the people around us, our neighbours. And we live in an ethnically diverse area are going to respond by the grace of God. But it is encouraging to see the age demographic, is great. I mean, Willingdon always had that I think just the vibrant young families, but also the older folks, which we need both. So we're hoping to cultivate that.

Rob Thiessen:
Well, one of the advantages of the fresh start that you made is that, you know, you think differently about hospitality. You take a look around the place and you go, is this a hospitable place? Are we set up an existing congregation? Often people are just into their routines, so they don't really ask themselves those questions. And in effect, quite often they can be kind of inhospitable, even though nobody there would suggest that they're not being friendly. But it's just that the seeker coming in doesn't know the ropes and there's no signage, and everybody seems to know where they're going, but nobody notices me. And inadvertently, you know, they're sending a message that, you know, you're not welcome. Really? We're busy here, and you know, you can't afford to do that as a new group, right?

Rob Thiessen:
Yeah. Yeah.

Matt Glezos:
You're definitely thinking intentionally about, the newcomer and, yeah it's sort of a tough balance, right? I mean, the way that I see the gathered church on a Sunday morning, we're there to worship together to be fed, in a sense, right, to be equipped for the work of ministry. And yet there's a component that hopefully, if you come through the doors and you're new, you like you said, you will feel welcomed. And so you do need to be intentional about that. I think it's like all of us, we want to talk to the people we know. We don't want to talk to people we don't know. So hopefully thats why, which again, when you're new, it's easier in the sense because you've hopefully been focusing on that in a more recent way, like why are we doing this? Why did we renovate, why did we move here? Why did we? And so it's near the surface more.

John Koehn:
If it is a new church you really don't know that many people anyhow. That's true. You always think, okay, have you been coming here for, you know.

Matt Glezos:
Yeah, it's more natural. That's true.

Rob Thiessen:
Well, this is really encouraging. I know, that you know, one of the courses and I don't know if you guys have considered running it, but the Alpha course has been very fruitful as being a way to sort of catalyze the invitations and really it's tailored for the seeker. Right. And so that's been fruitful, and that you mentioned the camps and even doing the things like you're doing like community fireworks. What a great way just to send a signal to people. You know, this isn't just an exclusive club here. We're here for the community, and that opens doors. So it's just. Yeah. Last question here, any strategic resources that you would recommend to people who are thinking about, well, how could we be a catalyst for renewal at our church?

Matt Glezos:
I think the best thing is to talk with those churches who've been through it. Like, for me, the catalyst came from being part of a church that was doing multiplication. Yeah. Was focused on that. That was, you know, prioritizing it, putting money and resources and had a leadership that was thinking that way. I don't know. I mean, God would have figured out another way to call me, but that was instrumental and I think most helpful because from my experience, the tough thing about church planting is there's a thousand ways to do it. And so you can read books and it's good to hear stories like, hopefully it's encouraging to hear our story, but like you said, it's not the practical pieces that is the key. The key is the heart and the mindset and and the willingness to sacrifice. So I would you know, I think that comes best to talking with those who, you know, reach out. There's a lot of great stories like this, right? Christ City is one, Northview did their mission plant of churches that were for whatever reason in in decline. And they were at that point of what are the next steps. And hopefully the mindset is how can we ensure that the gospel will still go forward in this region with whatever resources we have? And sometimes that does look like a handing off to a new ministry.

Matt Glezos:
But it's such a tricky thing. And so talking with those, that have done it, I think is the best way, because then you get a bit of the heart and some of the practical, I mean, we were so supported by Westside having been through it, the leadership having a task force with like with Norm and Lee and Jeff and Steve from the churches, I felt incredibly supported. I felt freed up to make the decision I need to make, but also had someone on the phone, hey, what do you think about this. Right? And knowing that they've been through it now, you're not always going to have that kind of task force. But I know that any of the churches, myself included, someone picks up the phone and sends an email, say, hey, we're thinking of this. What do you think? I think I've been incredibly helpful. And so I think hopefully as a, you know, as a MB community, we would we would talk more about those stories and look to help each other and even even beyond that.

Rob Thiessen:
Yeah. That's great. That is really good. Good advice Matt.

John Koehn:
So we're not the template.

John Koehn:
There's lots of them. Yeah.

Matt Glezos:
I think you see that right in the way that the different stories where things are going well. There are some, I would argue there are some common theological convictions you need to have in terms of what is a healthy church, according to, but the a lot of the details look different. Is it a campus, is it a brand new church? I mean, we were we were called a campus, but we're also called Tri-City church, which in some ways doesn't make sense. But it it made sense for our community to have the sense that we are like, what are we? We're a church. Yeah. But also from the sending church, it made sense for them to understand we're part of them. So we didn't sweat those details too much when we had a clarity of like, why we're doing it. And we feel it's it's faithful to the pattern of Scripture.

John Koehn:
And we got support from them, you know, such support of the pulpit or whatever. Yeah. They could so many ways.

Matt Glezos:
Yeah, yeah. It's so much better to do it with friends, I would say. I mean, I was able to, I think I preached about half the time the first year, which was a mandate from the task force, saying, we just want to make sure you have enough time. What a luxury, in a sense, to have help from all three churches. As I mentioned, youth.

Rob Thiessen:
Well, less in the.

Rob Thiessen:
Sunday I was here.

Matt Glezos:
Levi was speaking for me. Yeah, we still get help.

Rob Thiessen:
That is a real asset. And maybe that's a great thing for our listeners too, is you know, if you don't know somebody, call the BCMB office. Maybe I know somebody that I can put you in contact with. But it's churches helping each other. And like you said, you know, having a real time partner going, what are you doing? How are you figuring this out? And it is really, really helpful.

Matt Glezos:
And it is, it takes longer in a sense I would say, like it's more complicated. It would, you know, be easier for me just to be like, here's what I'm back in the day, right? That was my initial thought. I'm going to plant a, I'm just going to do it. I know what I want to do took longer. But it's always better. So I think that is sometimes the challenge is there is a hunger desire, even for maybe young planters to, you know, just to go. But it's I think it always goes better when you take the time. And yeah. And get help but it's going to take more time. But that's okay.

Rob Thiessen:
And you take the initiative as the leader with the churches to say, I'm looking for help because you could you come alongside, what can you offer? What can I glean. So yeah, this is fantastic. So good to hear the story and praise God for what he's doing here in Tri-Cities. The whole north side of the Fraser has sort of classically been a tougher place. You know, I started in Langley when we were in a school there at North Langley, and it just like Langley was easier. There's a lot of Christians around there. You know, whatever. Trinity Western, all those things. But it felt a little different over on the north side. You notice it? Yeah. And, but God has been faithful here, too. And the essential things that you're doing, preaching the word, worshiping as a community, calling people to follow Christ and trying to be salt and light and there's fruit coming. So praise the Lord for that. Thank you so much. Thank you for joining us on this podcast. Those of you who are listening, mom, dad, my brother, my sister, you know, and everyone else from the BCMB community, it's great to have spent this hour with you and to hear a little bit about the Tri-Cities story and have a great week, and we'll look forward to our next podcast together. Thanks for now. Bye bye.

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